SCAMMER PWNED

We shall look into this case from another perspective.

I was unable to ascertain the exact location of the OP. Therefore, I chose Canada (Federal level) and New York (State level; there is no applicable law in Federal level).



CANADA - DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE [SOURCE]
Criminal Code (R.S.C., 1985, c. C-46)

321 - PART IX OFFENCES AGAINST RIGHTS OF PROPERTY​

322 - Theft (R.S., c. C-34, s. 283.)​

(1) Every one commits theft who fraudulently and without colour of right takes, or fraudulently and without colour of right converts to his use or to the use of another person, anything, whether animate or inanimate, with intent​

(a) to deprive, temporarily or absolutely, the owner of it, or a person who has a special property or interest in it, of the thing or of his property or interest in it;​

(b) to pledge it or deposit it as security;​

(c) to part with it under a condition with respect to its return that the person who parts with it may be unable to perform; or​

(d) to deal with it in such a manner that it cannot be restored in the condition in which it was at the time it was taken or converted.​

…​

328 - Theft by or from person having special property or interest (R.S., 1985, c. C-46, s. 328; 2003, c. 21, s. 4.)​

A person may be convicted of theft notwithstanding that anything that is alleged to have been stolen was stolen​

(a) by the owner of it from a person who has a special property or interest in it;​

(b) by a person who has a special property or interest in it from the owner of it;​

(c) by a lessee of it from his reversioner;​

(d) by one of several joint owners, tenants in common or partners of or in it from the other persons who have an interest in it; or​

(e) by the representatives of an organization from the organization.​

UNITED STATES OF AMERICA - NEW YORK STATE LEGISLATURE [SOURCE]
Consolidated Laws

PEN - Penal​

Part 3 - SPECIFIC OFFENSES​

Title J - OFFENSES INVOLVING THEFT​

§ 155.00 Larceny; definitions of terms.​

The following definitions are applicable to this title:​

1. "Property" means any money, personal property, real property, computer data, computer program, thing in action, evidence of debt or contract, or any article, substance or thing of value, including any gas, steam, water or electricity, which is provided for a charge or compensation.​

2. "Obtain" includes, but is not limited to, the bringing about of a transfer or purported transfer of property or of a legal interest therein, whether to the obtainer or another.​

3. "Deprive." To "deprive" another of property means (a) to withhold it or cause it to be withheld from him permanently or for so extended a period or under such circumstances that the major portion of its economic value or benefit is lost to him, or (b) to dispose of the property in such manner or under such circumstances as to render it unlikely that an owner will recover such property.​

4. "Appropriate." To "appropriate" property of another to oneself or a third person means (a) to exercise control over it, or to aid a third person to exercise control over it, permanently or for so extended a period or under such circumstances as to acquire the major portion of its economic value or benefit, or (b) to dispose of the property for the benefit of oneself or a third person.​

5. "Owner." When property is taken, obtained or withheld by one person from another person, an "owner" thereof means any person who has a right to possession thereof superior to that of the taker, obtainer or withholder.​

A person who has obtained possession of property by theft or other illegal means shall be deemed to have a right of possession superior to that of a person who takes, obtains or withholds it from him by larcenous means.​

A joint or common owner of property shall not be deemed to have a right of possession thereto superior to that of any other joint or common owner thereof.​

In the absence of a specific agreement to the contrary, a person in lawful possession of property shall be deemed to have a right of possession superior to that of a person having only a security interest therein, even if legal title lies with the holder of the security interest pursuant to a conditional sale contract or other security agreement.​

​

​

​

…​

§ 155.05 Larceny; defined.​

1. A person steals property and commits larceny when, with intent to deprive another of property or to appropriate the same to himself or to a third person, he wrongfully takes, obtains or withholds such property from an owner thereof.​

tl; dr Stealing a property that you previously own, or on behalf of someone who previously own, can result in conviction of theft/larceny (I don't want to use the TF2 term "Scammer")

You need a Search and Seizure warrant in order to perform the recovery of stolen goods.

I agree with you Mattie, but I still think this is unfair. SteamRep's policies were too gray to fully warrant a justified sentence. If this would have happened today, where it's now fully written black on white that SR doesn't tolerate this type of behavior, then I wouldn't have been opposed to it.

I don't condone vigilantism, or any similar type of behavior, but we shouldn't be making exceptions.

'the law is a precise endeavour and as such we must be precise in interpreting it'
i'm sorry if you're asking me to throw logic out the window. not going to happen.

which steamrep admin scammed? hm? you sure those are the real guys?


also 'norris' aka 'eduardkhil' doesnt type like that at all.

yes man i have post pictures look

http://i.imgur.com/A6jSQ.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/pmp43.jpg

it shows the url of the real middleman too i checked steamrep and it was him for sure

but i aint no fool i felt something wrong and deleted them

Chaos,

You obviously have a lot of anger. It would have been smarted to use that anger against the people that rob us of our hard work and even dare insult us before they disappear. Ever had the "yeah, I did send the payment. My paypal address is [email protected]" <USER OFFLINE>. Go use that anger to hunt those bastards down who have no regard for us and the community we are trying to run here. Don't come in here and tell me how I am an "asshat" and a "dick". Nice to see admins acting so professionally. Glad someone gave you the power to overlook things in the community. I can rest comfortably at night. As far as I am concerned my conversation with you is over. So please go find another place to piss and throw in a couple of stupid useless sentences.

I have already discussed this point earlier. If you don't bother reading the whole thread, it doesn't make sense for you to go and start regurgitating stuff that has been discussed. Have the decency to read a thread before jumping in and spewing garbage on the screen.

http://steamrep.com/profiles/76561198039841444?t=1328500361

you can see me as friend ( 76561197992197263 )

and my nickname at that time

http://steamrep.com/profiles/76561197992197263?t=1328477081

I am not insulting anyone. I am using my right to speak how I feel. If I disagree with some people I have a right to speak my mind about it. If I disagree with some policies or some actions taken in the past, regardless of rank or superiority. I have a right to speak about it. Nowhere does it say that freedom of speech warrants an outcome on a sentence. Just because someone is a White Supremist racist does not make it right for us to judge them in any harsher way then any other person when a crime is committed. Next thing you know just because someone comes from a low income community housing project they are automatically found guilty until proven innocent or are "prejudged" as most likely being guilty of a crime. I am simply exercising my right to speak. I spoke, I responded to any retaliations thrown at me. I am here in an open forum manner as this is what this thread is. I started it not to boast but to bring to the forefront an increasing problem and a solution I created that has not been previously recorded (a selfless act of good samaritan work regardless of how vigilante the actions were) to better this community. I am not worried about a label or a branding. I have enough reputation in the community that even if I am branded and banned from certain places I will continue trading and acting honestly and with integrity like my beliefs warrant me to do. Stating that I can do something or that I dislike something does not mean I am going to take some vigilante self indulging action here. This is not who I am or what I do, and this is why I brought my "actions" into the public eye to show that this matter needs to be addressed.

Speaking of courts and laws. Where are the laws protecting us being scammed and told "too bad" by paypal and steam. This is why I did it. I have tried NUMEROUS times to let the law handle these cases. Instead nothing is done, I did this to prove to the community that maybe if I will do it and no one will take drastic actions to better remedy the problem, be ready to see more of my style of action happening by those who are truly the heart and soul of this community. The honest traders. The fair traders and the ones who are here to enjoy this style of activity.

But no, you decide to throw the book at it and say. Hey, the law states this. Let me tell you something. That law that you clearly pulled up does not apply here because we are from all over the world and we have no protection from those local laws. They are local. Be it federal or municipal, they do not apply to the internet. Call the cops. Have them come to my house. See what they tell you. Then come back to me with your "law" books. Why do you think things like steamrep and sourcoep rep exist? because the law is just and fair to us?

And if you really want to know where I am from, I am from Ontario Canada. And the offence occured in the digital world. Precedence on online fraud has already been set. ONLY if both parties are in the same jurisdiction do the laws of that jurisdiction apply (if we were both in the USA then US federal law would apply). How do I know this because I got frauded by a California man and he got arrested for ebay fraud in amount over $250,000 (I was one of MANY victims) and I got a polite formal letter from California Lawyer saying he was filing a class action law suit against the convicted person. He asked if I wanted to be involved in the suit. I agreed. Surely after he was sentenced and approximately 60% of the funds were recovered to pay out the victims, I was told I am not eligible as the laws only apply to USA citizens. Furthermore, I could not be part of the class action law suit of part of the compensation package. This was decided by the California Court where this was trialed. So I personally have experience with online fraud and know that your "legal" local system is thrown out the door. By the way, NO Canadian judge will EVER convict me or try me for this even if I write a letter of admission to the law office of Canada. And they will not Extradite me to the country where the offence took place, little own to USA.

Repost 'cuz your appeal is locked for now.
Dronefly said: ↑

You can not take 2 different reasons and combine them for the same sentence. When someone "revenge" scams a scammer it still falls under the presedence of "personal" gain as a motive. We see it in the news all the time.​

​

However, my motives and actions were COMPLETELY selfless and I had ABSOLUTELY no motivation or GAIN of ANY sort from my actions. Can you not see the difference? How can you all sit there and not see the difference? Are your mind that clouded by this topic?​

Just because you got nothing material from this doesn't me you got no gain. Your prideful boasting of your actions proves that you gained immense personal satisfaction.
Not like there's anything wrong in being selfish to begin with, especially if you realize other people are just as selfish as you.

Like I said before, I did this to bring to light something that was a problem. I did not do this for boasting rights. I knew I would endure some sort of sorrow out of posting publicly my good deed. I did it because I got tired of the increase in fraud in the community. I covered this earlier and why I did it. If you choose not to read back what I said then I will not regurgitate what I have said before. With your logic, EVERYONE is selfish. I am selfish in doing a good deed to help others. Sure then I am selfish. I am proud and will do it again if I see the chance. This is my human nature. I live by a very honorable system. I have always lived by it. If it got me in hot water because it was "outside" the lines of the law then be it. I know that if I get thrown into a jail cell and someone throw the key for it, then it wont be as bad as me having to go to sleep at night and creating a jail in my own mind as to the lack of action I took. That is much worse a punishment I believe then a little orange tag or a ban from a website that I can still read the posts, add the people and trade with them should I choose to. I am not worried about the consequences, I am worried as to what is happening to this community and what must ultimately be done to correct the increase on problems that is not being addressed on a larger scale. When you try to fight an out of control fire, you must accept certain loses, accept that damage that could have been stopped must happen for the greater good of putting out the fire as a whole. putting out a small spark in the middle of the forest will not stop the large inferno that is building behind it. You must think of the bigger picture, and take drastic actions and do your best to concentrate on stopping it as a whole not which acre is burning and how to stop it from burning. Same applies here. I am trying to get awareness on this matter and hope enough people go back and discuss this and want to act to stop the scammers and what they are doing to our community. Military action is sometimes warranted in time of war. If you ask me, we have the biggest war against these scammers we have EVER had in our trading history. I want action and I am trying to get others to want it too. That is the intention of this entire thread and the self persecution that came with it. No one reported me, I brought this up of my own free will.

That DEFINITELY is NOT what I said. Why, I've NEVER, EVER wanted ANYTHING simply for my own sake, ever. /sarcasm
The only truly selfless person is a corpse. Being selfish is NOT bad, because if it was you're condemning the entire human race, hell, the very act of wanting to live, as evil: being self-CENTERED is (expecting other people to sacrifice their well-being for yours ie. scammers), on the other hand, is bad.
You might not have done it for boasting rights, I can't get inside your mind. However, all the self-righteous condemnations you've been throwing out and your constant insistence of how proud you are of your course of action make it very hard to think otherwise.
Simmer down, we're not looking for martyrs here.

He responded to the first part of my post but couldn't acknowledge his blatant disregard for overarching pragmatism in policy which we as admins have to consider. That seems about right.

Didn't expect a response to that in the first place. Just continue with proclaiming the provocative nature of your actions and your quasi-free speech sentiments (which actually doesn't have any congruency to the action you took). What you fail to realise is that you have become the outlier. You are outspoken, highly unrespected, throwing insults when you can to defend your judgement. You are trying to stick it to a system which stands for the utmost integrity in trading, our pursuit is noble and our policies are created for the community, for the greater good of the community.

As SR admins, we have seen a few of your type pop up in our day, same attitude etc. As long as we continue to get input from several of the most respected and significant TF2 communities who command a high proportion of the trading community, our ideals will remain community-centric and individuals like you will remain outcast and redundant.

I am not asking you to throw your logic out of the window but too look past definitions. I want to hear a reason why scamming scammers is a bad thing that goes beyond "by scamming the scammer you become a scammer yourself". I don't want to say that none exist, but I for now can't really think of one.

Because to me it just sounds like a convenient way to close the case without doing any thinking.

Well if you didnt do it for "Personal Gain" then why is the title "SCAMMERS PWNED"? Seems like your basically Broadcasting that you scammed. if you didnt want attention you wouldnt have posted at all, and their wouldnt be a huge shitstorm over this. You also have got to be one of the most self-contridicting people ive ever seen. I agree with you that scammers shouldnt profit. I dont have a problem with you scamming him, however you leave the people here at steamrep scratching their heads. If you dont care about the tag, why are you appealing it? Finally, you havent done anything for the "greater good" except blur lines as to what steamrep tolerates. The decisions they make here dictate what will happen to the rest of these "vigilante" types. YOU may not care about what happens, but the rest of us however do.

A decision concerning vigilante types has already been made. It is a great summary by Starburst of policy issues which has gone over the head of this individual.
http://forums.steamrep.com/threads/76561198035410021-green-is-the-colour-sr-scammer.1553/#post-4919

there's clearly no arguing with this dude